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  1. #111
    Quote Originally Posted by xFaNtASyGiRLx View Post
    I think what would be nice is whatever you guys discuss in your private "developers" section on the progress of things, could be discussed here, or in a section where only registered people who run servers can see. I understand that DICE may not want to share info with the public in case they are unable to deliver, but AT LEAST ITS GETTING COMMUNICATED... and people don't feel left in the dark. Its better than waiting and wondering if anything is being done and when everything is quiet- people assume their is nothing being done. You admins/developers have that advantage in knowing these things so you have to understand why some who are in the dark feel the way that they do even THOUGH YOU know its not the case. KWIM?
    First of all, CCC is in the doghouse for talking about Fight Club. First rule of Fight Club is you do not talk about Fight Club.

    Too bad this thread is showing why it wouldn't be so nice to share that info.

    It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation. If DICE pre-announces possible fixes or improvements with a rough schedule and then typical software life happens and things get delayed, the dogs go wild. Then the howling gets pretty damn vicious. I've seen it myself. "DICE couldn't deliver a beer fart during Octoberfest on time," yada, yada. If DICE stays totally silent, they're uncaring, lazy, greedy assholes that collect money and don't do anything.

    There's no percentage either way.

    What I think would be safe to say, though, is that a) DICE wants to hear about the worst problems and does listen, b) DICE has addressed some bad problems already, so they are working on this stuff, and c) [here's the tough one] priority goes by player population and guess what? The PC population is the smallest of the three. That's just a fact. That doesn't mean PC doesn't count or isn't important, or that it's DICE's fault that the PC population is small*, it just means that when you have 3 units of labor and 5 units of work to do, you have to prioritize, and Xbox and PS are higher priority when all else is equal. And that just means that it takes more time to address PC-specific issues.

    * For any cross-platform game where there is no special advantage to any platform (i.e., Dragon Age II wouldn't count, since the UI was significantly better on the PC), consoles combined is always larger than PC. That's just the reality of the market.
    Last edited by PapaCharlie9; 17-02-2014 at 19:12.
    Don't send me private messages (PMs) unless you really need privacy, like your game server password. If you just have a question or need help, post in one of the threads. It's extra work for me to answer questions and give help in private messages and no one else gets the benefit of the answer.

  2. #112
    When Vincent/Darklord shares info with us at GCN, we have never gotten vicious or whiney, despite what some on here seem to think. In fact, we showed more appreciation for any bit of knowledge.

    But yeah.. damned if you do , damned if you don't and here I am just trying to run my servers the best way I can with whatever limitations I'm given. I have three boxes dedicated to Battlefield, so yeah.. I'm not one to have given up quite yet but I do see many admins who have and it makes me sad b/c I don't want to see this game die but its apparent, people's patience is wearing thin!

  3. #113
    I think it would be great if DICE would setup a mailing list for servers owners. From what I understand DICE already has one for the ranked providers. IMO this works great for Valve.

    some examples from Valve.
    announcement that an update is coming.[email protected]/msg53972.html

    announcement that the update was released including a change log.[email protected]/msg53973.html

    Letting people know of important changes that are coming soon.[email protected]/msg53886.html

    I would be happy if could sign up to something like the above. Battlelog doesn't work and I don't really wanna sign up to 10 different sites that DICE might be a part of.

    R26 got install on my NFO server around 1:48pm and the change log is no where to be found.

  4. #114
    The one and only Bassyboy
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    Quote Originally Posted by marrr View Post
    R26 got install on my NFO server around 1:48pm and the change log is no where to be found.
    NFO posted some info about the patch on their forums.

  5. #115
    Yep... looks like it was part of the fixes DarkLord was referring to... hopefully idletimeout isn't far behind then.

    Chill n Kill Gaming -

  6. #116
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    My intent in opening this thread was not to generate a DICE bashing thread and am glad to see for the most part it has remained constructive. As a player and a server operator I have supported DICE and rightly so, they have produced some of the best MP experiences in gaming and am sure they will continue to do so.

    My frustration is at BF4 and its seeming rushed development cycle. I have experienced another franchise (*cough* COD) that went down a dev cycle that for many only served to diminish the experience although it maximised profits. Sure, EA and DICE are in it for profit but there is surely a bottom line of delivering a product 'as advertised'. With BF4 it simply was not ready for primetime either with the client or server. I, as a consumer surely have some rights in expecting a product that works as advertised. Unfortunately gamers have little consumer protection and server operators even less.

    I very much appreciate Procon's existence and the dev team behind it as I simply would not have operated BF servers without it. I appreciate Zaeed's point of game complexity but to be honest as a consumer that is not my concern. Point's raised by other server oerators here such as non-functioning server vars, restrictions in server setups (by the way this sounds like there has been a change of ethos at DICE) etc are really very valid concerns. There is a danger that the culture becomes one of DICE are doing us a favour by fixing these issues, no, this cannot be allowed to be the norm.

    Hopefully, the feedback to DICE translates into a longer dev cycle that allows for a more polished product. Gaming is a massive business that generates billions in profit, it is not unreasonable to expect some level of consumer protection. It is debates like these that have created consumer protection in other mass produced products. I do believe DICE intended to do as much for BF4 as they could but my fear is that the business end will now step in and they will be told to more or less 'move on'. The fear of one poster here that since SA is being released then they believe the game is now 'primetime' is a very founded fear which I share.

    As a consumer BF4 has made me very wary of what games I support in the future. I do not have the time or indeed the motivation to buy a game in the 'hope' it will be ready for a consumer launch. I want to buy a game and have enough consumer protection to feel 'assured' I am not wasting upwards of 80 on a game and even more in server rental costs.

    I am glad my post generated this discussion and hope some positivity can be gleaned from it, however, I don't believe this is possible without some level of discomfort. Many thanks to procon for allowing us, its users to have a place to share our thoughts, it is very appreciated.

  7. #117
    Phogues Rubber Duck
    Join Date
    Dec 2010
    The fact is, for several months now, I have been silently moderating (read: deleting) posts that I saw that added nothing constructive to the conversation, the majority of these posts were something along the line of:

    OMG DICE wtf are you doing, you suck
    Mostly from this thread, from a wide range of different users, some who had 2-3 posts, some who had hundreds.

    The reason was, they added nothing to the discussion, they added nothing to any discussion that results in anything constructive.

    No one has complained about me deleting their posts until the other day, when someone commented sparking this discussion.

    You have an opinion, and you are correct, you are more than entitled to it, but it has a time and a place, and these forums, in particular that thread, is not the place.

    No one here is going to attempt to pretend that DICE have released a perfect game, I would wager that the vast majority of the people that work at DICE agree with you that BF4 was not in a good state at launch, and still has issues today.

    We have been accused of "Defending DICE" and "sympathising" with them, and to some extent this is true, but not in a special way, its just a by-product of keeping things on topic and constructive.

    I left this post open, since it was civilised and not going off topic in another thread. Right now, I'm going to lock this post, and leave it here so people can read.

    The simple way of putting it is this, posts on this forum are supposed to be about running servers, and procon. If you want to post on these forums, make sure it is broadly about one of those 2 topics, and in particular, make sure it is relevant to the topic you are posting in.

    I've let this topic run its course, but I won't let further topics like this last that long.

    If people see topics going off-topic, feel free to use the "report post" button at the bottom of every post, a moderator will take a look at it and take action if they deem it necessary.

    That said, if you have any comments on how we admin/moderate this forum, including any suggestions on how we can do this better, then shoot me an email ([email protected]) or pm me, and we can take it up in private.

    tl;dr Stay on topic, keep things civilised and constructive, or your post will go missing. This thread being kept in public so people can read what was said



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